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 One of the cool things...

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Rob
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PostSubject: One of the cool things...   Mon Nov 08, 2010 3:48 pm



...about living near the Great Lakes is that storms sometimes turn up some interesting things:

1800s Shipwreck Washes Up In Sleeping Bear

Recent strong winds and waves have delivered part of a shipwreck to the Sleeping Bear Dunes National Lakeshore. The piece measures 15-feet wide and 40-feet long.

Lakeshore staff and volunteers are working to identify the wreckage. Laura Quackenbush, a museum technician with Sleeping Bear, says the ship was probably built sometime after the mid 1800s.

"Because of its dark color we're pretty much sure it's white oak, which was the standard for construction of boat timbers and frames.

"The major construction pieces of a boat were often white oak, and when they're wet these are dark colored. And they do survive a pretty long time because white oak is naturally rot resistant and pretty tough wood."

The wreckage washed-up on the beach west of Sleeping Bear Point about two-and-a-half miles from Glen Haven.
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pamh36
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Mon Nov 08, 2010 4:03 pm

That is very interesting. Can't wait to hear more about it.


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Vanesa
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Mon Nov 08, 2010 7:40 pm

Wow! That's interesting for sure! Tell us about it as soon as you can.

Vanesa.


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Rob
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Wed Nov 10, 2010 9:24 am

Here's a more in-depth article about the ship...

Shipwreck Washes Ashore
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Lisa
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Wed Nov 10, 2010 9:42 am

Wow! That picture is amazing. Thanks for the article! How cool is that?? Just going for a walk along the beach - and to find something so historic and incredible! WOW.




~ I don't want to go through the motions. I don't want to go one more day without Your all consuming passion inside of me.
I don't want to spend my whole life asking, "What if I had given everything, instead of going through the motions?"  ~

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Amy
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Wed Nov 10, 2010 1:08 pm

Wow, that is COOL!! Thanks so much for sharing this Rob! Thumbsup


“Not all of us can do great things. But we can do small things with great love.”

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LIWnut
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:03 pm

Rob, do you know any information about the schooner that went down in Michigan that Caroline Quiner Ingalls' father was on? Name? Date?? Did it ever wash ashore anywhere?


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Lisa
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Wed Nov 10, 2010 3:27 pm

October of 1844 - but I don't know the exact date or the name of the trading ship. Henry had been working as a trader with the Indians. (I hope you don't mind me popping into the conversation. ) I wonder if there's a website that lists all of the shipwrecks that have taken place on Lake Michigan. There can't have been a lot that happened in October of 1844.


~ I don't want to go through the motions. I don't want to go one more day without Your all consuming passion inside of me.
I don't want to spend my whole life asking, "What if I had given everything, instead of going through the motions?"  ~

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Rob
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Wed Nov 10, 2010 3:32 pm

Savannah, you know more about it than I do, so thanks for popping in...
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Vanesa
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:50 pm

So...It could be from the ship which Father Quinner was travelling in? That's more than interesting! I don't know if there were other ship accidents in the lake, tough... scratchead

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pamh36
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Thu Nov 11, 2010 5:19 am

That article was quite interesting, and it was neat to see a picture too. At least they have an idea that it can be one of two ships, but it sounds like it'll be difficult, if not impossible to identify where the piece came from. Thanks for sharing the article, Rob.


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MissOleson
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Sat Nov 13, 2010 3:57 pm

LIWnut wrote:
Rob, do you know any information about the schooner that went down in Michigan that Caroline Quiner Ingalls' father was on? Name? Date?? Did it ever wash ashore anywhere?

Savannah wrote:
October of 1844 - but I don't know the exact date or the name of the trading ship. Henry had been working as a trader with the Indians. (I hope you don't mind me popping into the conversation. ) I wonder if there's a website that lists all of the shipwrecks that have taken place on Lake Michigan. There can't have been a lot that happened in October of 1844.


As far as I knew he died in November 1845. I am pretty sure the name was "Ocean". I could be wrong, though. I never heard anything about it washing ashore. I always just assumed the ship was just lost.


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Vanesa
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Sat Nov 13, 2010 7:56 pm

I've read that Henry Quiner died in the fall of 1844. I couldn't find the name of the ship, tough... scratchead

Vanesa.


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Lisa
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Sat Nov 13, 2010 8:16 pm

Everywhere I've read, the sites have listed his death in October of 1844. (Or they give a generic "fall of 1844".) But that doesn't mean that it's certain. Just because we read it on the internet doesn't mean it's true.

Edited to add: Interesting...I did find a couple of sites that list Henry's death as having been in 1845, but according to the book Laura's Album: A Remembrance Scrapbook of Laura Ingalls Wilder by William Anderson, it was on a schooner that was on a trading trip to the Straits of Mackinac in 1844 that he and the rest of the crew were killed. (Page 11)

I wonder where the discrepancy is coming from.


~ I don't want to go through the motions. I don't want to go one more day without Your all consuming passion inside of me.
I don't want to spend my whole life asking, "What if I had given everything, instead of going through the motions?"  ~

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MissOleson
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:46 am

You know, I really don't remember when I heard it (it was years ago), but the month stood out to me because it was the same as my birthday month and the name "Ocean" stood out because it happened on a lake. Smile And I know it was 1845 because it is mentioned on the marker for Caroline in Brookfield. This is the picture that I took of it a couple of years ago:


So, I decided to see if I could find anything the other day. I just became really curious to know now. Smile So I did some searching. I found this site:
http://greatlakeshistory.homestead.com/files/o.htm
His "Ocean" is the first one listed.

Then there is this report
Quote :
The schooner Ocean, of Mackinac, was visited this morning by the steamer Champion about 6 miles north of St. Joseph, and 2 miles from shore. She is a complete wreck having lost her boat and davits, carried away her mainmast, her sails torn into rags, hatches off and lumber in the hold. There were no persons on board, and it is supposed that the crew were all lost. She had the appearance of having been capsized and righted again. -Detroit Daily Advertiser, November 10, 1845
That is mentioned on this site. http://www.pioneergirl.com/2008_02_01_archive.htm

So, where the discrepency comes from, I couldn't even imagine. scratchead Interesting, though, isn't it?


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LIWnut
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Mon Nov 15, 2010 3:57 pm

This is what the link above had to say.

OCEAN

Other names : none

Official no. : none

Type at loss : schooner, wood. 2-mast

Build info : 1836, Swan Creek, Mich

Specs : 43 t.

Date of loss : 1845, Nov 10

Place of loss : 6 mi N of St. Joseph

Lake : Michigan

Type of loss : storm

Loss of life : 6

Carrying : lumber

Detail : Found on her beam ends 2 miles off shore after a heavy storm. She appeared to have capsized and all her crew lost.

Out of Mackinac. Master: Capt. McGregor(d). Her 2nd mate, Henry Newton Quiner [perished], was grandfather to author Laura Ingalls Wilder.
Sources : wmn,wmhs,nsp,bb,wmn



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Lisa
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Mon Nov 15, 2010 4:49 pm

Very interesting, indeed! Thanks, MissOleson!


~ I don't want to go through the motions. I don't want to go one more day without Your all consuming passion inside of me.
I don't want to spend my whole life asking, "What if I had given everything, instead of going through the motions?"  ~

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Vanesa
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Mon Nov 15, 2010 8:24 pm

Savannah wrote:
Everywhere I've read, the sites have listed his death in October of 1844. (Or they give a generic "fall of 1844".) But that doesn't mean that it's certain. Just because we read it on the internet doesn't mean it's true.

Edited to add: Interesting...I did find a couple of sites that list Henry's death as having been in 1845, but according to the book Laura's Album: A Remembrance Scrapbook of Laura Ingalls Wilder by William Anderson, it was on a schooner that was on a trading trip to the Straits of Mackinac in 1844 that he and the rest of the crew were killed. (Page 11)

I wonder where the discrepancy is coming from.

Of course, you must be right. As you've quoted later, the "Ocean" was lost in November 1845. But I didn't write it was lost in "the fall of 1844" for I've read it in the net. I never trust internet so awfully much. I fact I've read about the accident in the book "Laura", by Donald Zochert. Of course William Anderson, who is an expert in Laura's lore also tells the date was 1844. He didn't specifies the date of the year, nor the name of the ship. Zochert doesn't mention the ship's name, either.


Vanesa.

P.S: Thank you for the great links! Thumbsup


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Lisa
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Mon Nov 15, 2010 8:41 pm

Vanesa wrote:
Savannah wrote:
Everywhere I've read, the sites have listed his death in October of 1844. (Or they give a generic "fall of 1844".) But that doesn't mean that it's certain. Just because we read it on the internet doesn't mean it's true.

Edited to add: Interesting...I did find a couple of sites that list Henry's death as having been in 1845, but according to the book Laura's Album: A Remembrance Scrapbook of Laura Ingalls Wilder by William Anderson, it was on a schooner that was on a trading trip to the Straits of Mackinac in 1844 that he and the rest of the crew were killed. (Page 11)

I wonder where the discrepancy is coming from.

Of course, you must be right. As you've quoted later, the "Ocean" was lost in November 1845. But I didn't write it was lost in "the fall of 1844" for I've read it in the net. I never trust internet so awfully much. I fact I've read about the accident in the book "Laura", by Donald Zochert. Of course William Anderson, who is an expert in Laura's lore also tells the date was 1844. He didn't specifies the date of the year, nor the name of the ship. Zochert doesn't mention the ship's name, either.


Vanesa.

P.S: Thank you for the great links!

*gasp* Vanesa! I hadn't even noticed that you'd used that phrase just before I posted! I know that you know your Laura history, for sure. I never for a moment thought that you named a date just because you'd read it on the net. I hope it didn't sound that way to you. I just meant that the sites I'd read didn't list a specific month and day - that's what I meant by "generic fall of 1844". I'm so sorry that it sounded rude!
The credit for the great links and the information about the Ocean in 1845 goes to MissOleson.

I'm still puzzled. I'd like to find out what the right date is for sure. William Anderson is well-known for his Ingalls-family research and has had access to family letters and papers and such, so it seems as if he'd be careful to be accurate with the date.....But yet, the Michigan Shipwrecks site is careful with its information, too - and they have a different date.


~ I don't want to go through the motions. I don't want to go one more day without Your all consuming passion inside of me.
I don't want to spend my whole life asking, "What if I had given everything, instead of going through the motions?"  ~

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Lisa
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:05 am

Curiouser and curiouser....I sent an email to the Laura Ingalls Wilder Museum last night, and they (a lady named Tara Jackson from the museum) were kind enough to reply just a moment ago that their records show Henry Quiner's death as having been in 1844.

Hey! I wonder if Beth Ingalls would know why there are two dates given for his death!


~ I don't want to go through the motions. I don't want to go one more day without Your all consuming passion inside of me.
I don't want to spend my whole life asking, "What if I had given everything, instead of going through the motions?"  ~

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MissOleson
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:29 am

That is all so interesting that the info could be mixed up like that. Whether it was in 1844 or 1845, who knows now, right? Smile But (and this is just a theory Smile ) since I have started to really get into the genealogy world, alot of records state an event (birth, date, marriage, et.c.) as having happened "about ----". So they don't have an exact year, but they give an approximate year. So what I am wondering is if the 1845 is really correct (some people must have some sort of records of it) and since, through the years, as records sometimes tend to change or get lost, people aren't entirely sure on the date, they give an "about" time now because that has been recorded the most. Am I making any sense with that? Sometimes I write these things out and I never know if I explain them the way that I should. greenS Anyway, again, that is just a theory. Smile

That is interesting, Savannah, that they told you that. You know what I should do? I should contact the Historical Society that erected the marker. In fact, I think I will. I will see if they can give me any info on where they got their information from.

Also, I am going to the library this Saturday. I will see if anyone there can help me with any info on Lake Michigan shipwrecks. Maybe I will be able to find some sort of article even.

It is kind of fun playing the little detectives with this, though, isn't it? grinsmiley




F.Y.I. Maybe we shouldn't believe what anyone says, anyway. Maybe everybody's facts are wrong (including Mr. Anderson's!). I finally found the graves of my great-great-grandparents and their two daughters. The one daughter is older than the other one. Yet, on the older one's tombstone it says she was born the SAME EXACT year as the yonger one. How that ever happened is beyond me! scratchead Especially since she was like 2 years older. Anyway, all I am saying is that even non-internet info can be wrong! Smile


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Lisa
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:36 am

That's a very possible theory, MissOleson! It's possible, too, that the shipwreck itself took place in 1844, and that some of the wreckage washed ashore in 45, and made the newspapers, and over the years, the dates were confused. I know that some of the wreckage washed up - but I don't know how much.....Very curious! Thanks for checking with a couple of places. Maybe we'll be able to figure this out! In the meantime it's fun trying to figure out the possibilities! I might just buy myself a detective's hat and magnifying glass.


~ I don't want to go through the motions. I don't want to go one more day without Your all consuming passion inside of me.
I don't want to spend my whole life asking, "What if I had given everything, instead of going through the motions?"  ~

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flatbroke
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Tue Nov 16, 2010 11:06 am

That's awesome Rob. And Vanesa, they made a song by Gordon Lightfoot of a lost vessel on Lake Superior.

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Lisa
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Tue Nov 16, 2010 11:11 am

I loved that song. When I was a little girl I had no idea how big the Edmund Fitzgerald was, either. I was very surprised to see how big it really was.

Sorry we've hijacked your thread, Rob.


~ I don't want to go through the motions. I don't want to go one more day without Your all consuming passion inside of me.
I don't want to spend my whole life asking, "What if I had given everything, instead of going through the motions?"  ~

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flatbroke
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PostSubject: Re: One of the cool things...   Tue Nov 16, 2010 11:19 am

Yeah Rob, if we hijacked it, you can have it back.

For a price.....
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