Downton Abbey SPOILER THREAD

One more episode.

Wow, that went by fast.

Lisa wrote:

Sure did! It said on a British website that this Sunday is the finale, and then we have a while to wait until the Christmas one. Depending on how things are looking, I may wait until the day after Christmas to watch it. I *have* read that  

Spoiler:

this season, but still....There are a lot of other things that could happen. And I don't want to be traumatized on Christmas day.    So yeah....I may wait until the next day.

 Reading that kinda cracked me up!  Yep, I'd rather not be traumatized on Christmas Day either....good plan. 

One of these days I'm going to find some time to write in here soon.  Lots of good stuff going on lately...these last two episodes have been excellent!  I am going to miss it SO much once it's over...AGAIN.   I can feel a season 1 re-watch coming on again soon!!

Amy wrote:

 Reading that kinda cracked me up!  Yep, I'd rather not be traumatized on Christmas Day either....good plan.  

  Well, I couldn't help but think of LAST year's Christmas episode. I mean, REALLY??? I can't imagine seeing our sweet Matthew with his eyes fixed and blood trickling out of his ears....on CHRISTMAS DAY.   It was bad enough when I DID see it. So yeah....that's why I'm planning on watching it the day after.

Marilyn, I sure hope so! As long as Bates doesn't go to jail or hang for it.

Lisa wrote:

Amy wrote:

 Reading that kinda cracked me up!  Yep, I'd rather not be traumatized on Christmas Day either....good plan.  

  Well, I couldn't help but think of LAST year's Christmas episode. I mean, REALLY??? I can't imagine seeing our sweet Matthew with his eyes fixed and blood trickling out of his ears....on CHRISTMAS DAY.   It was bad enough when I DID see it. So yeah....that's why I'm planning on watching it the day after.  

Indeed, my dear friend....perfect 'day after Christmas' TV viewing. 




No no, I get it...that WAS pretty ridiculous---it was like, "Gee, Merry 'feel good' Christmas!"  Your all time favorite DA character is dead...even better, unexpectedly!  And how about, just in case there's any question he may have lived through it, we throw in a CLOSE UP shot of him lying there all bloody with his eyes fixed.  No question now!  Wouldn't want to ruin your Christmas thinking he MIGHT be alive, after all! 

Hmm, can you tell I'm STILL bitter?? 

Tell us how you really feel, Amy.  

I don't wish to alarm anyone, but there is talk on the DA board that Thomas Barrow might be the next major character to meet his maker and that it might happen in this week's episode. If that's true, I will really be bummed. What would LHOP be without Nellie and Harriet? Just a bunch of nice folks dealing with a trouble or two.

This week is an extra long episode with a garden party, so I'm looking forward to the whole thing; especially now that Green is back and Bates knows he's guilty. Should be interesting.

Hmmmm

I don't think it's Thomas because I've seen an interview with Rob Who plays him and he said that he's still alive at the end.  Check it out,

I forgot about this interview.

Did anyone else feel like maybe something was 'lacking' with this episode?   I don't know, my friend thinks it was the best one so far for this season, and for me it was just....meh.   I mean, I enjoyed it...I wasn't expecting anything THAT exciting to happen, since that is usually reserved for the Christmas episode, based on past history.  But this episode reminded me of how I felt about DA the first few episodes this season...enjoyable, worth watching of course, but 'missing something'.  Maybe it's just me.  

Marilyn, are you out there?  I just realized I hadn't seen you today on the facebook discussion page!  

I'll have to comment more later...I'm off to bed...but I'm just curious what everyone thought.  This is going to be torture, waiting until Christmas!!! 


Oh, I will say this....I LOVED all the Baxter and Mosely stuff!  Oh my gosh, SO nice to see him feeling more confident, looking at things in a whole new light, and believing in himself!  All because of her!  They are actually a really neat (and believable) match! 

And I have to say that I did like how they wrapped up the whole Daisy/Alfred thing and I hope he is now gone for good.  I never liked Alfred.  And as far as I'm concerned, Daisy can go off to live with Mr. Mason, Ivy and James can find different jobs elsewhere, and it's time to get some fresh new 'blood' (so to speak  ) in the kitchen. 

So much more to say, but alas, my eyes are going crosseyed.  Time for bed!

Everyone is saying pretty much the same thing on the DA forum, Amy. Not enough wrapped up, nothing much interesting happening, and, of course, not getting to see Green's murder.

I never liked the downstairs love quadrangle, so I am glad it's over. I would have preferred if Jimmy had left and Alfred stayed, but at least Daisy can move on now and maybe Jimmy will get tired of hanging around where he is obviously unhappy. I can't stand his character. Some on the forum are saying they would like to see Thomas and Jimmy together. Ugh, no thanks. Thomas, while a villain, deserves better than that little twerp.

quote="bethandmanly"]Everyone is saying pretty much the same thing on the DA forum, Amy. Not enough wrapped up, nothing much interesting happening, and, of course, not getting to see Green's murder.[/quote]I really need to get back to the forum.  So far I've just been glancing here and there on the FB discussion page.  

So, do you think Bates did it?  My friend thinks he did and will be thrilled if JF proves her wrong...if he did, then he did exactly what Anna believed he might, and we expect more from Bates.  It would have been more interesting if we'd seen the big showdown between Green and Bates and if Bates could have brought Green to justice somehow.  Someone mentioned that it's certainly possible there were more victims out there of Green's, and that it was some other victim's man who killed him.  I really didn't want some kind of 'who done it' kind of plot again though.  Guess we'll know (hopefully) more at Christmas.

Cheryl wrote:

I never liked the downstairs love quadrangle, so I am glad it's over. I would have preferred if Jimmy had left and Alfred stayed, but at least Daisy can move on now and maybe Jimmy will get tired of hanging around where he is obviously unhappy. I can't stand his character. Some on the forum are saying they would like to see Thomas and Jimmy together. Ugh, no thanks. Thomas, while a villain, deserves better than that little twerp.

Complete agreement there....we have actually been privy to a few redeeming qualities about Thomas---I no longer despise him like I used to.  Jimmy---well, I got nothin'.  

So, what is everyone's feeling about the Mary triangle?  I love when Robert comes home and says, "So when did that ménage happen?" or something like that, LOL!!!  

Here's my take.  First off, let me just say that I don't 'expect' Mary to ever find a love like hers with Matthew.  I'm not being unrealistic and I know that those two actors shared quite the chemistry as well, which is hard to come by.  I like BOTH Gillingham AND Blake.  I feel like she has a 'decent amount' of chemistry with both, and I can  see her with either of them, actually---I think Gillingham could be very well suited for her, but that Blake would be the one to challenge and surprise her in many ways, as he has already done.  Of the two, I would most like to see her with Blake. IF I have to pick one.  I just don't see her truly loving either of these good men in the way they would deserve to be loved.  I don't have that 'feeling' for them.  And I'm not so sure I wouldn't feel that ever again---I feel like it MIGHT just be the actors.  It's possible Julian Fellows won't just keep going through possible suitors though, so this might be 'it'.   I think we're being set up to believe it will be Blake she chooses---the 'fun' pig scene and the connection they had there...the initial dislike the two had for each other, much like she and Matthew had in the beginning, or at least Mary for Matthew....the unexpected holding of her baby, which was done (I believe) not to 'win her over' but by pure reflex by him, showing what an unusual man he is, considering men expected the women and nannies to care for a crying baby.  Mary was clearly stunned by that move, lol.

So yes, I am warming to Blake and can see this pairing...I just don't truly feel anything, if I'm being honest.  I am the kind of person who needs a major romance to really keep me going.  Yes, we have Bates and Anna, but we all know a romance is different on TV once the couple is actually married.  It was like Dr. Quinn, and how we felt by season 4, once Michaela & Sully were married.  It was just 'different' and less exciting.  Good thing REAL life isn't like that, but on TV, that's just how it plays out.  

In fact my friend made the comparison of Michaela & Sully, and how we won't feel anything from anyone with Mary again, like we did Matthew.  Sorry, but I'm not as convinced.  For those of your who 'know' Sully & Michaela, they were like a slow burning fire, building and building and we had SIX seasons with them. We could NEVER have accepted anyone else into Michaela's life again had they killed Sully off.  I'd rather she be alone, as horrible as that sounds, lol.  But Matthew & Mary had 2 or 3 seasons.  It was powerful, but I still can 'envision' Mary with someone else....I can picture her happy with someone again.  I'm just not sure either of these guys is 'the one'.  But no, no one will ever be 'Matthew'.  I think we all accept that.

Thoughts?

Whoever she ends up with, I'm anxious to get 'the Mary' back who was with Matthew.  She said it herself, that Matthew brought out the best part of her and that she was afraid of being the Mary that she was before him.  That is EXACTLY what's happened and I'm finding her about as unlikeable as she was in the beginning of season 1.   With Matthew, Mary had become my second favorite character, and if Julian Fellows isn't careful, I may never get my 'feeling' back for her again.

Yes Amy, I'm here. I have been on the DA forum too. Gee, do I post toooo much?? lol.

I must confess that this whole season has been a bit of a letdown for me. It started so slowly and took so long to get started. By episode 3, the only story that had me captivated was Anna's and all I wanted to really know about was her and how she was doing.
The downstairs romance and/or lack of one was boring. I think the boys ruined it for me, Jimmy pretending to like Ivy to get Alfred upset and Alfred not seeing that Daisy liked him. The girls were just lovesick puddles.
I didn't like the Edna story and cheered as she ran across the lawn away from Downton!! Don't come back!!
By episode 5-7 the story was really interesting and I couldn't wait til the next Sunday rolled around for another episode. I felt bad for Edith who seemed lost without Gregson and then shattered after finding out that she was pregnant. I'm glad that she opted to not have the abortion. But the storyline with Rose and Jack was so dumb. I think the guy is ok looking but can't sing!! The whole ROSE story is a waste of time, do we really need a Sybil replacement?
I was almost dreading washing this last episode. I was afraid that we would see Bates do "something stupid" to put himself back in jail. I was away for the weekend and had to wait til I got home to see it online. It was better than I had feared. I loved the Baxter/Molesley love affair, they are so cute. I hope that he keeps Thomas away from her. I really like Baxter and think that she has a good heart. She only clams up and gets rigid when Thomas is around. Hopefully Molesley can stay between them.
I LOVE MR. MASON. I think that Daisy needs to visit him more. He is so sweet and truly cares for her. I wouldn't want to see her leave the show but Daisy needs to go and live at the farm and be Mrs Patmore's vegetable supplier. I wonder if Daisy now understands how William felt when she didn't love him because Alfred didn't love her. Hopefully the next one that comes along with be just right for Daisy. Maybe Mr Mason could marry Mrs Patmore, then Daisy would have a mother and a father, lol.

I have to admit something here. While this series, in my opinion, didn't stand up to any of the previous ones (wartime or M&M's marriage), I have been suffering "Downton Fever" for the last 8 weeks. After each episode I spent hours reading the posts at the forum and rewatching the shows during the week. I bought the new Behind The Scenes book and have read almost all of that. I counted the days and then the hours til the next episode was on again and then it started all over again. I can honestly say that I am SO GLAD that we have a few weeks before the next installment airs at Christmas. I need a rest!!! Someone else on the forum said that they have never been so involved in any other show and I can agree with them. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE the show and want it to continue, I just need to take a break and get back to other things in life again.

Gee Amy, you're right, I do post too much, lol.,

I have no time to reply, but I had to mention this....

Lisa wrote:

Another thing that really bothered me was a line that Bates said. He said to Anna something like, "So you've gone off Green, eh?" And she asked him why he would say that to her, and he replied, "When he first came here you liked him. You thought he was funny."    Seriously, I don't believe that he would have said that to her. He knows how agonized she is over what happened, and to say that to her is basically taunting her since he KNOWS that Green is the one who attacked her. *I* felt like I'd been slapped, and it wasn't even me who was being addressed. Now, granted, I do tend to be sensitive...but still. I thought that was incredibly unkind, knowing that Green was her attacker, and that she already is likely struggling with "Was I TOO nice to him??" to begin with - and Bates is NOT an unkind man.

I am SO glad you brought this up!! I had completely forgotten about it, and I don't know HOW, because I was struck as SOON as the words were out of his mouth. What the heck?? That was VERY un-Bates-like, I am sorry. If he didn't know that it was Green, that might be one thing, but we KNOW that HE knows. Does JF actually think that WE don't know that Bates knows?  That was just....horrible, coming from our beloved Bates. He would never have uttered those words to her, not in a million years. It WAS like taunting, and it made me almost consider the fact that he is upset with her that she was so 'interested' in Green in the beginning. That maybe he does blame her, even if only slightly. Are we supposed to think that Bates feels that way? Because that concept really feels foreign to me. But I can't help but 'go there'. He was SO upset with how friendly she was with him. Maybe now that he's had time to stew over this after discovering that it WAS Green, perhaps he can't help but go back to what Anna's and Green's 'friendship' was like, and may think (as society would think) that she 'teased him' or led him on. We know logically this is NOT true, of course, but the fact that he said that to her has my mind going in all kinds of directions, because that is NOT the Bates we know and love.

I think he was just trying to see what her feelings were.  I can't remember at the moment if he knows that Green is dead at this point, but she knows.  I think that he is just trying to see and/or make sure that he knows that it was Green.  If it wasn't Green, then Anna wouldn't have been affected if Green came back.  If it was Green, then he was just seeing her reaction to prove himself right.  (I think I'm talking in circles  )  It wasn't a loving statement to make to your wife but he had to know what she felt.

I tend to agree with Marilyn about Bates.  I think he was just making certain it was Green.  As to whether Bates killed Green, I think that is what they want us to believe, but it may turn out that he did not.  It was stated that there were several witnesses to the accident.  On the other hand, depending on how crowded it was, it would be easy for Bates to trip Green with his cane without anyone noticing.

So glad that Daisy is over Alfred.  That storyline was really getting on my nerves this season.  I had always liked Daisy in the previous seasons.  Ivy and Jimmy can go now too.

The Molesley/Baxter storyline is the one the is most interesting to me now.  I would really like to know her relationship to Thomas.  Also I'm wondering how interested Molesley is in Baxter.  It appears he is interested in her, but I also think he has ulterior motives.  I think he wants to know what is going on between her and Thomas since he has overheard their conversations a couple of times.  Plus if he could get something on Thomas that could get Thomas dismissed, that would help him move back up in the ranks.

Lori wrote:

The Molesley/Baxter storyline is the one the is most interesting to me now.  I would really like to know her relationship to Thomas.  Also I'm wondering how interested Molesley is in Baxter.  It appears he is interested in her, but I also think he has ulterior motives.  I think he wants to know what is going on between her and Thomas since he has overheard their conversations a couple of times.  Plus if he could get something on Thomas that could get Thomas dismissed, that would help him move back up in the ranks.

Oh my gosh, that is brilliant. (Do I sound british, or what? ).  This thought never occurred to me either Lori!  WOW!  I think you may be on to something here!  I do think he is genuinely interested in her, but his proximity to her may not have started just because he was attracted.  I think that might be just a happy accident.  I seem to recall that he seemed a little annoyed in one episode when she tried to inquire about people.  

I don't have time to comment too in depth right now, but had to comment that I truly believe Bates knew without a doubt at that meal in the kitchen (sitting across from Green) that he was the one who did it.  His epiphany moment was clear on his face.  I'd have to go back and watch the scene again, but I remember Bates continuing on with passing a dish or something like that as Green declared what he was 'doing' as the opera singer was performing, and then there was just this 'lightbulb moment' that was written all over him, which instigated the infamous 'killer glare' that everyone was talking about.  That was 'it'...I didn't see anything that would make us believe that Bates had any doubt whatsoever, like he would need to do some digging to find out for sure.  I didn't see a man with a 'suspicion', I saw a man who had learned a new truth.  Now, IF he didn't know, then I think the scene was played poorly by Brendan Coyle (which is hard to fathom)...if there was any doubt, we wouldn't have seen a killer glare in my opinion, we would have seen a 'confused' look on his face, a 'questioning' expression.  His face seemed to show he had his mind completely made up about what happened.

Just my take on it!  

I had to laugh that we're ALL in agreement about the 'kitchen quadrangle'!  I'll tell you what, I was bored with them LAST season---I was sorry to see so much time devoted to all of them THIS season!  But I guess they had to come up with a conclusion for some of them.  And Marilyn, I guess I don't want to see Daisy go completely either---I'd like to see her live with Mr. Mason and then pop in every now and then to visit---supplying vegetables as you say.  That's about all the 'Daisy' I need in my life!   (Alfred's gone, NOW for Ivy & Jimmy....maybe there will be an offer for them to work in another mansion somewhere that they just can't refuse.  ).

I don't disagree that Bates knew who it was Green at the table, but if your going to kill someone I think you want some reassurance from a more reliable source (Anna). Otherwise he was just a jerk for saying what he said to her.